Author Topic: Masked gunman terrorizes Oregon mall, killing two, then himself  (Read 3534 times)

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Robert Harvey

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http://www.foxnews.com/us/2012/12/11/reports-gunfire-at-oregon-mall/
video on the foxnews page as well as the article.
 Fox News - Masked gunman terrorizes Oregon mall, killing two, then himself.

A gunman who witnesses say was wearing camouflage and a white plastic mask opened fire in a shopping mall near Portland, Ore., killing two and wounding one other before killing himself, police said.
Clackamas County sheriff's Lt. James Rhodes says law enforcement who flooded the Clackamas Town Center in response to the afternoon shooting didn't fire any shots.
Witnesses described a harrowing scene, as the gunman appeared to be dressed in body armor while firing off an estimated 60 shots from a semi-automatic rifle. One witness told KPTV that the gunman ran past her and her boyfriend and "had the look of death in his eyes."
Another witness, Kira Rowland, told KGW-TV that she was shopping at Macy's with her infant when the shots started.
"All of a sudden you hear two shots, which sounded like balloons popping," Rowland told the station. "Everybody got on the ground. I grabbed the baby from the stroller and got on the ground."
Rowland said she heard people screaming and crying.
"I put the baby back in the stroller and ran like hell," Rowland said. "It was awful. It was shots after shots after shots like a massacre.
"It was just awful."
Holli Bautista, 28, said she was shopping in the Macy's for a Christmas dress for her daughter when she heard a two or three pops that sounded like firecrackers.
"I heard people running and screaming and saying `Get out, there's somebody shooting'," she told The Associated Press. "It was a scene of chaos."
She said hundreds of shoppers and mall employees started running, and she and dozens of other people were trying to escape through an exit in the department store.
Bautista said the Macy's opens into the food court area, where it was reported the shootings took place. Bautista said it sounded like the shots were coming from that direction.
Once Bautista made it out of the mall, police officers were directed her and the other shoppers across the street to another shopping center.
As she looked across the street, Bautista said she could see hundreds of police officers, firefighters and emergency workers pouring in.
"They're coming in from multiple different agencies. There's tons of ambulances lined up," she said.
Macy's employees Pam Moore and Austin Patty told the AP the shooter was short, with dark hair, dressed in camouflage. He had body armor and a rifle and was wearing a white mask, they said.
"I heard about 20 shots and everyone hit the ground," Moore said. "That's when we all just ran."
The Associated Press contributed to this report.

Time will tell.

M1911A1

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Re: Masked gunman terrorizes Oregon mall, killing two, then himself
« Reply #1 on: December 11, 2012, 11:53:42 PM »
Hmmm...
Sounds like a wanna-be who couldn't afford a ticket to the Batman movie.

I bet that he wasn't wearing "body armor" either.

The real issue, of course, is not guns, shooting, "assault rifles," or large-capacity magazines.
The real issue is why, and how, our society is creating these death-wish nut-jobs, and why they remain unidentified until they "pop."
Steve,
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"Qui desiderat pacem, præparet bellum."

commonground

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Re: Masked gunman terrorizes Oregon mall, killing two, then himself
« Reply #2 on: December 12, 2012, 04:03:01 AM »

The real issue, of course, is not guns, shooting, "assault rifles," or large-capacity magazines.
The real issue is why, and how, our society is creating these death-wish nut-jobs, and why they remain unidentified until they "pop."

I agree with that.  We get what we cultivate.   ??? 

“do not go to stupid places with stupid people to do stupid things at stupid times.” - Gabe Suarez

GTG

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Re: Masked gunman terrorizes Oregon mall, killing two, then himself
« Reply #3 on: December 12, 2012, 05:57:15 AM »
How secure are they going to feel to go shopping there again? >:(
'The illegal we do immediately; the unconstitutional takes a little longer.' Henry Kissinger

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pstan13

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Re: Masked gunman terrorizes Oregon mall, killing two, then himself
« Reply #4 on: December 12, 2012, 06:02:15 AM »
What I don't understand is how an armed man, firing 60 rounds in a crowded mall just weeks before Christmas, can only kill two and severely wound one other.
"Laws that forbid the carrying of arms disarm only those who are neither inclined nor determined to commit crimes."
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SARGeek

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Re: Masked gunman terrorizes Oregon mall, killing two, then himself
« Reply #5 on: December 12, 2012, 08:33:50 AM »
Sounds like he was just a narcissistic weirdo. I don't imagine it was body armor either. If he couldn't afford the Batman ticket he probably couldn't afford Level IIIa either.

Another part of the problem is that some many folks believe it's the cops job to protect us. If more folks understood that it our job to protect us them more would carry and he never would have gotten 60 rounds off, he'd have been dead long before that. Once that happens a few times we won't have nearly as many incidents like this.
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Bill MO

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Re: Masked gunman terrorizes Oregon mall, killing two, then himself
« Reply #6 on: December 12, 2012, 01:35:56 PM »
Quote
Daniel Martinez had just sat down at Jamba Juice inside Clackamas Town Center when suddenly he heard rapid gunfire.

He turned around and saw a masked gunman wearing dark clothing about 10 feet away.

“I just saw him (the gunman) and thought, ‘I need to go somewhere,’” Martinez said. “It was so fast, and at that time, everyone was moving around.”

Martinez ran to the nearest clothing store. As he ran, he motioned for another woman to follow; several others ran to the store as well, hiding in a fitting room.

http://www.katu.com/news/local/It-was-surreal-mall-goer-recounts-nightmarish-experience-183101241.html

So your only thought while being only 10 feet from the shooter is to run. And we wonder WHY we have what we have in this Country.

At 10 feet even a knife would have been usable. That's 3 steps at most, most likely 2 and you have contact, giving him pain.

Article does not say but most likely the gun was not pointed at him when he saw him or he would have been shot. He was there by himself so no one else to worry about and still run was his answer.

I'm not Rambo and I'm a old man but.....do something to stop the evil in front of you.
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commonground

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Re: Masked gunman terrorizes Oregon mall, killing two, then himself
« Reply #7 on: December 12, 2012, 02:15:34 PM »
If there had been a trained CC in Martinez's position, in about 2 seconds the BG would have had three center mass hits.  If that didn't stop him, it definitely would have distracted him from his charter.  Follow-on rounds as necessary would have probably finished the job.  BTW, Sheep either run or faint.   ???
“do not go to stupid places with stupid people to do stupid things at stupid times.” - Gabe Suarez

SARGeek

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Re: Masked gunman terrorizes Oregon mall, killing two, then himself
« Reply #8 on: December 12, 2012, 02:20:26 PM »
+1 Bill MO!

10 feet and he's toast, he has voluntarily forfeited most of the advantages of a rifle in combat and now I am likely to be better equipped for the situation than he is. I can probably even move in such a way as to take advantage of my handgun's better maneuverability and possibly avoid getting shot while taking him down. Even a knife; how many times have we discussed gun vs. knife at close range on this very forum? The consensus and history both point to the knife being a very viable option at this range. And once you close that third step you are "inside" his rifle where he can't even aim at you.
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commonground

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Re: Masked gunman terrorizes Oregon mall, killing two, then himself
« Reply #9 on: December 12, 2012, 03:41:58 PM »
Here is an update.  Sounds like he had a problem with the gun, maybe a magazine malfunction.  The one guy, DeCosta was going to go get him.

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2012/12/12/gun-jammed-in-oregon-mall-shooting-as-authorities-id-suspect/?test=latestnews
“do not go to stupid places with stupid people to do stupid things at stupid times.” - Gabe Suarez

flyover

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Re: Masked gunman terrorizes Oregon mall, killing two, then himself
« Reply #10 on: December 12, 2012, 06:41:42 PM »
Sounds like the shooter had a jam and didn't know how to clear it, also didn't know to run an AR "wet".  I also heard that the gun was stolen from an acquaintance.

commonground

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Re: Masked gunman terrorizes Oregon mall, killing two, then himself
« Reply #11 on: December 13, 2012, 04:18:25 AM »
Sounds like the shooter had a jam and didn't know how to clear it, also didn't know to run an AR "wet".  I also heard that the gun was stolen from an acquaintance.

Ok, I'm gonna display my ignorance.  What does run an AR "wet" mean?  Never heard that term before.  ???
“do not go to stupid places with stupid people to do stupid things at stupid times.” - Gabe Suarez

flyover

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Re: Masked gunman terrorizes Oregon mall, killing two, then himself
« Reply #12 on: December 13, 2012, 09:40:18 AM »

The term "wet" comes from how I was taught to run an AR.  It means plenty of lube, not as in dripping wet but not totally dry either.  The Ars that I have shot tend to quit functioning when ran dry.  Back in the Veitnam days, the military produced a comic book style instruction manual for the proper lubrication and cleaning of the M-16.  The gas driven guns tend to be a bit dirty with part of the propellent gas being directed into the action to operate the bolt.

I don't know if the piston driven guns, think AK system, have that problem as I have never shot one.

DroidGeorge

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Re: Masked gunman terrorizes Oregon mall, killing two, then himself
« Reply #13 on: December 13, 2012, 11:50:28 AM »
Those first M-16s would jam if you just looked at them funny.  Guys would put condoms over the muzzle just to keep crap and water out.

George

Smile. It makes people wonder what you are up to.

GTG

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Re: Masked gunman terrorizes Oregon mall, killing two, then himself
« Reply #14 on: December 14, 2012, 06:35:41 AM »
The Shooters Mother was on the local news. First she apologized for the pain her son had caused. She explained the Shooter wanted to join the Marines at 18. At 17 he broke his foot & couldn't join. The result, he completely changed to a twisted individual.
'The illegal we do immediately; the unconstitutional takes a little longer.' Henry Kissinger

"A Nation Of Sheep Will Beget A Government Of Wolves" Edward D Murrow

"Either We Are A Country Of Laws With A Constitution, Or We Are A Banana Republic"

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Re: Masked gunman terrorizes Oregon mall, killing two, then himself
« Reply #15 on: December 14, 2012, 11:58:35 PM »
Oh, OK—I get it: The mall shooting was the Marines' fault.
I want to thank the shooter's mother for clearing that up.
Steve,
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"Qui desiderat pacem, præparet bellum."

Bill MO

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Re: Masked gunman terrorizes Oregon mall, killing two, then himself
« Reply #16 on: December 15, 2012, 02:38:57 PM »
Oh, OK—I get it: The mall shooting was the Marines' fault.
I want to thank the shooter's mother for clearing that up.


It always is. It's something or someone's fault never the shoot themselves.
"Is this persons bad behavior worth me having to kill them over?" Guantes

"If you are not training in “the reality of the fight” you are training to a lower standard." Roger Phillips

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M1911A1

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Re: Masked gunman terrorizes Oregon mall, killing two, then himself
« Reply #17 on: December 15, 2012, 04:07:01 PM »
I've already posted the following on another forum, but I believe that it fits here as well:

Crazy people remain crazy, or get crazier, in a permissive Progressive society that believes it is wrong to incarcerate them against their will—as if the insane were able to make such a reasoned choice.
And then, when uncontrolled crazy people do crazy, harmful things, the permissive Progressive society tells them that they bear no responsibility for having done those crazy, harmful things. No penalties and no restrictions are applied.
The result of this insane Political Correctness on the part of the permissive Progressive society is that insane people are not identified, and are neither observed nor restricted. Thus they are free to do all of the harm that their personal demons require of them.
 
And, since they both behaved true to form, thus I have defined both the mall shooter and the Connecticut child-killer.
 
But that's OK: It was the gun's fault. After all, crazy people are never responsible for their own actions, Q.E.D.
Steve,
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"Qui desiderat pacem, præparet bellum."

pafindr

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Re: Masked gunman terrorizes Oregon mall, killing two, then himself
« Reply #18 on: December 15, 2012, 04:32:49 PM »
Looks like he may have took himself out because someone with a CCW drew down on him. But the guy with the CCW didn't shoot because he didn't have a safe backstop.
http://easybakegunclub.com/news/1943/Clackamas-Mall-Shooter-Was-Confonted-By-Concealed-.html
Do what you've always done, get what you've always gotten.

pstan13

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Re: Masked gunman terrorizes Oregon mall, killing two, then himself
« Reply #19 on: December 15, 2012, 05:23:19 PM »
Whatever it takes!  :)
"Laws that forbid the carrying of arms disarm only those who are neither inclined nor determined to commit crimes."
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Robert Harvey

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Re: Masked gunman terrorizes Oregon mall, killing two, then himself
« Reply #20 on: December 15, 2012, 10:09:29 PM »
Looks like he may have took himself out because someone with a CCW drew down on him. But the guy with the CCW didn't shoot because he didn't have a safe backstop.
http://easybakegunclub.com/news/1943/Clackamas-Mall-Shooter-Was-Confonted-By-Concealed-.html
excellent
Time will tell.

commonground

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Re: Masked gunman terrorizes Oregon mall, killing two, then himself
« Reply #21 on: December 16, 2012, 03:34:07 AM »
So we're not just a bunch of crazy shooters?  The CCW did good.  Of course, that will not be sensationalized, nor will the fact that, he probably short-stopped the massacre.  When the pray shoots back, the hunter thinks twice about the hunt.
“do not go to stupid places with stupid people to do stupid things at stupid times.” - Gabe Suarez

pop pop

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Re: Masked gunman terrorizes Oregon mall, killing two, then himself
« Reply #22 on: December 17, 2012, 11:37:38 AM »
Aperantely there was a CC within shooting distance. He chose not too fire because of what was behind the shooter. 

http://now.msn.com/nick-meli-who-had-a-concealed-weapon-thought-about-shooting-oregon-mall-killer

Bill MO

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"Is this persons bad behavior worth me having to kill them over?" Guantes

"If you are not training in “the reality of the fight” you are training to a lower standard." Roger Phillips

"It's gotta be who you are, not a hobby." reinman45