Author Topic: The Suarez Remington 870 Stakeout  (Read 552 times)

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Taurian

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The Suarez Remington 870 Stakeout
« on: March 09, 2017, 05:47:28 AM »
<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S_fsZFCZQuY" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S_fsZFCZQuY</a>
« Last Edit: March 09, 2017, 12:39:25 PM by Taurian »
What most 21st Century Americans simply do not grasp is that the Constitution and Bill of Rights were not written to to give rights to the citizens of our then-new nation, but was instead written to tightly constrain the federal government.

oldranger53

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Re: The Saurez Remington 870 Stakeout
« Reply #1 on: March 09, 2017, 10:16:16 AM »
I like all these SI weapons that are for sale.
Sigh.
So many guns, so little money!
Never shall I fail my comrades. I will always keep myself mentally alert, physically strong and morally straight, and I will shoulder more than my share of the task whatever it may be.  One hundred percent and then some.

Taurian

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Re: The Saurez Remington 870 Stakeout
« Reply #2 on: March 09, 2017, 12:03:30 PM »
I like all these SI weapons that are for sale.
Sigh.
So many guns, so little money!
Personally, I would pass on this one.  I have enough chaos around me, and I sure don't need more. I would like to see it shot at night with defensive loads; #4 Buck, 00 Buck, and slugs. Between the porting and recoil, I don't think that it would be a pretty sight. In fact, you might not even be able to see the sights after the first shot. No sir, I think that I will pass on this one!
What most 21st Century Americans simply do not grasp is that the Constitution and Bill of Rights were not written to to give rights to the citizens of our then-new nation, but was instead written to tightly constrain the federal government.

oldranger53

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Re: The Suarez Remington 870 Stakeout
« Reply #3 on: March 09, 2017, 04:04:58 PM »
Lately I've been considering a "tactical" shotgun.
After almost buying a Winchester 1200...almost, I decided that when I go tactical with a shotgun, it'll be a semi-auto of some type.
It will have an extended mag tube.
It will have rails.
It will have a folding, or collapsible stock.
Whatever else the future tactical shogun may have, it will have those features.
Never shall I fail my comrades. I will always keep myself mentally alert, physically strong and morally straight, and I will shoulder more than my share of the task whatever it may be.  One hundred percent and then some.

M1911A1

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Re: The Suarez Remington 870 Stakeout
« Reply #4 on: March 09, 2017, 06:24:02 PM »
The pistolgrip-stock shotgun: A really stupid concept!

Aim it? No, I don't think so.

I, too, will pass.
Steve,
retired leathersmith and practical shooter


"Qui desiderat pacem, præparet bellum."

CR Williams

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Re: The Suarez Remington 870 Stakeout
« Reply #5 on: March 10, 2017, 08:43:44 AM »
The pistolgrip-stock shotgun: A really stupid concept!

Aim it? No, I don't think so.

I, too, will pass.

To be precise, that's a bird's-head grip not a pistol grip. Supposedly the bird's-head is much easier on the hand than the pistol grip.

At this time I 1) don't have a tasking that this type of weapon fits and 2) might not be able to run it well given ongoing wrist and elbow issues. It's possible that a 20ga variant would resolve the latter, but #1 is the main thing here.
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M1911A1

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Re: The Suarez Remington 870 Stakeout
« Reply #6 on: March 10, 2017, 01:16:04 PM »
To be precise, that's a bird's-head grip not a pistol grip. Supposedly the bird's-head is much easier on the hand than the pistol grip...

"Easy on the hand" is not the issue.
Stabilizing the shotgun, and making accurate hits: Those are the issues.

Can't do those things consistently, with either a pistol-grip stock or a birds-head-grip stock.
On these two, I will pass.
Steve,
retired leathersmith and practical shooter


"Qui desiderat pacem, præparet bellum."

Taurian

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Re: The Suarez Remington 870 Stakeout
« Reply #7 on: March 13, 2017, 09:52:27 AM »
As a follow-up to the original article by Suarez, this was released:

Quote
Invariably, every time I post something about the Stakeout I will get emails from guys who simply do not know. Its like the pudgy doctor that has not kept up with modern science telling to eat grains and go jogging. So here is the long and short of it.
 
The ATF has made rulings that a “shotgun” originally sold with a pistol grip only, and that has never had a buttstock attached, is not actually a “shotgun”, but a “firearm”. It can be listed as “firearm” or “other” on the 4473 and any other FFL documentation. In essence it is exactly like an AR-15receiver.
 
There is no minimum barrel length for such a firearm. The only important point is that it not be short enough to be “concealable”. If it was concealable it would be classified as an AOW (“Any Other Weapon”) and be an NFA weapon. The ATF Tech Branch has stated the weapon must be over 26” to be considered not concealable.
 
Multiple people have submitted inquiries about this to the ATF and they have received the same response: That it is not considered a shotgun if it came from the factory equipped with a pistol grip. And if it is 26” or longer, barrel length does not matter.
 
Mossberg Firearms is selling a similar weapon for the economy minded as the Shockwave 590, and Black Aces Tactical has been selling similar weapons with barrels as short as 8”.
 
Thus the Stakeout, with a 14” barrel and an overall length of 26.5” is a “firearm” and not subject to any NFA regulations.
 
FFL Dealers: When you log in the Stakeout, do not incorrectly list it as a shotgun. It is not a shotgun. List it as Other Firearm, Firearm, or Other. When you transfer it on the 4473, do the same.
 
End User: Do not remove the pistol grip stock under any circumstances. Do not change the pistol grip for any other type of pistol grip. Do not add a stock. Do not shorten the barrel or add a shorter barrel. Do not conceal this on your person. If you do any of these things, you may be in violation of federal laws, and it is at your own risk.
What most 21st Century Americans simply do not grasp is that the Constitution and Bill of Rights were not written to to give rights to the citizens of our then-new nation, but was instead written to tightly constrain the federal government.

oldranger53

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Re: The Suarez Remington 870 Stakeout
« Reply #8 on: March 13, 2017, 05:16:27 PM »
Interesting disclaimer to the "end user".
Seems a guy would be ok by adding length via stock, but then the barrel would be an issue perhaps.
No problem in concealing it, I'd think.
Never shall I fail my comrades. I will always keep myself mentally alert, physically strong and morally straight, and I will shoulder more than my share of the task whatever it may be.  One hundred percent and then some.

Taurian

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Re: The Suarez Remington 870 Stakeout
« Reply #9 on: March 14, 2017, 05:11:35 AM »
Interesting disclaimer to the "end user".
Seems a guy would be ok by adding length via stock, but then the barrel would be an issue perhaps.
No problem in concealing it, I'd think.
Ayup! If you add a stock, the firearm would become an SBS and would be subject to a stamp.

I have fired shotguns with both a standard pistol grip and a cut-down, modified stock. Neither are pleasant to shoot. The key is with the support hand on the pump handle; maintaining a strong grip is crucial. I have fired them with 00 Buck and #4 buck and it is definitely not pleasant.

When Boo-Boo (my beloved 12-gauge Mossberg 500) was outfitted with a pistol grip, which was a Hogue unit if I recall, the pistol grip broke at the mount when attempting to fire a 1-ounce slug. Luckily, the shotgun was fired from the waist position and not how they recommend it being fired at face level.
What most 21st Century Americans simply do not grasp is that the Constitution and Bill of Rights were not written to to give rights to the citizens of our then-new nation, but was instead written to tightly constrain the federal government.